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help understanding a long ago blood test I just recently received

Published on: March 29, 2024 • By: Pips · In Forum: Dogs
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Pips
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March 29, 2024 at 06:20am
I would love any insight on a very long ago blood test. the abnormal results include: Low hematies, low hematocrit, high MCHC, low platelets, low procalcitonin, with the presence of macroplates and acanthocytes. thanks so so much!
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Liz Buchanan BVSc MRCVS
Keymaster
March 29, 2024 at 09:14am
Hello - I'm afraid that context is everything.  The problem with blood machines, particularly in the past, is that vets used to get ex-hospital ones; very good machines, but the guidelines on them were for humans;  an owners' eye used to hone in on the red writing and the 'HI' and 'LOW' and they would call us back very worried, where as a few red values outside the normal range in a pet without related clinical signs, were frequently ignorable (or rather, could be explained away by the waiting time, or the machine, or the size of that animal's red blood cells, or other such factors -  so did not necessarily reflect badness in the patient). Vets would sometimes get more information by running a PCV / total solids and looking for circulatory-related clinical signs if they were concerned, but they would make this call in the context of the animal in front of them, about whom I know nothing. It would depend why they were running the blood sample - and the appearance of the dog - whether they felt further tests to be necessary.  This is particularly true of platelets, which can clump togther and were notoriously difficult to count by machine when I qualified over 20 years ago.  You don't say how far these bloods go back, but vets are obliged to keep your clinical notes for a certain amount of time.  The RCVS could clarify this for you and you may be able to get hold of the original clinical notes, in order to understand more.   In one or two surgeries where I worked, the nurses used to measure Haemtocrit and total solids by hand as a starting pooint, so they wouldnt have appeared on the print out.  Furthermore, the 'high' and 'low' catogies on these patients are artificial;  if you were to test 100 normal (in themselves) dogs, there would almost by mathematic definition be some animals with values over the lines of 'normal' lines on the blood chart.  In summary then, I'm afraid that its how the bloods fit into the bigger picture that counts.
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Pips
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March 29, 2024 at 11:20am
thank you so much for responding.  The test was from May 2022. I received both the test and the clinical notes very recently.  I have been asked to go through my dog's past to create a list of all of the meds she was given and then note which were 'good' or 'bad.' It's not a task that will be possible for several reasons.  I think i was hoping that those highs and lows = a specific immune disease. I think i was being unrealistic.  I couldn't even figure out how MCHC could be high with the two h words low.  I am finding it very challenging to try to figure out which of several drugs administered at once was the 'bad. ' It's a lot more complicated and I am having a very challenging time in our small south american city. I think i was thinking those highs/lows would = 'oh that is specifically' xyz immune disease. 'immune disease' was one of the many things written within those clinical notes I recently received. I feel like something specific would somehow guide me. The vet who wrote that  included other diagnoses I had never seen, and was likely unaware that a colleague gave her xyz medications prior to her injecting her drug, which I am unsure if were injected before or after that blood was drawn. thank you so much - I was hoping those patterns would be something obvious. but i dont know why i thought that. thanks so much again!
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Pips
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March 29, 2024 at 03:43pm
I don't want to be greedy by providing more context, as I am already so grateful for your response. I won't provide context about our today, but if you have any general tips for how to extract meaning from the past that would be helpful for future vets for the purposes of them being able to not give her a drug that she has had a past adverse reaction to, please know that help would be so so appreciated. All I have are tests and then thousands of pictures and conversations that include prescriptions and then me being told when/how to sub things out. but in terms of this particular question- I can add the pic of the test, if that is somehow helpful, while also knowing that the clinical picture that time was relevant in every way to those results. I am just unsure if the tests and diagnoses at that point are relevant to today in ways that could inform her future care (and of course am just looking for any guidance that may be possible). I have asked my vet, from that time, for his insight. The entire situation I am asking about occurred over a weekend.  He did not work weekends. The local clinic that we agreed I would go to re: emergencies is the clinic that handled this situation.  When I recently wrote them in hopes of learning anything, I was informed that the vet no longer works at the clinic, sorry.  I will addd pics in a few minutes with clarification if that is ok while knowing it's a long time ago and while underssatnding your response and being so grateful for it.
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Pips
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March 29, 2024 at 05:10pm
hi. sorry. don't worry. I am going through all whatsapps from may 6 to may 9 and it was an absolute nightmare re: meds/drugs/diagnoses/tests beyond that blood test done at that time (regarding things from ticks to poo (clostridium 3+). there were so many drugs and and meds within a short time. my vet's messages to me at that time told me not to worry about that blood tests because the suero (like whatever fluid they put in the iv) would have diluted her blood and that was why the platelets were low. sorry. my life is a bit of a nightmare. i am only trying to extract meaning from the past as a vet told me, a few months ago, that my dog's first ever three tests, in may 2021 indicated everything important to know- which apparently means that her life today is a consequence of drug hypersensitivity and whatever immune + genetic things polyy something aromatic hydrocarbons can do a a puppy's body. I am having a hard time in general, but your response led me to review 3939 whatsapps and i have learned so much more than i thought had happened. i think what i am learning and will timeline for a vet we dont have but dream of will give them information that will be helpful in some way re: drugs or maybe immune disease. sorry. this is why i got off fb. i feel sad that her future depends on my ability to create something meaningful from her life for a vet to see as i dont understand science and just have 20,000 + pics and notes and conversations from a long ago past i never wanted to revisit. thanks. sorry
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Liz Buchanan BVSc MRCVS
Keymaster
March 30, 2024 at 12:03am
Hello again and sending hugs.  This all sounds incredibly stressful for you;  it can be incredibly difficult for a client, especially if e.g. your education is more towards the arts, other sciences or practical stiff, so the technical jargon means relatively little to you.  Reading the history is one thing you pay your vet for;  handing it (or better, photocopies of whatever you have) to them, without comment, and letting them take responsibility for extracting the important clinical bits, might be one very good way of reducing your stress.   I would write down the following questions:   1) What is my dog's problem list at the moment?  2) Is there anything more that we need to find out?   3) What, if any, treatment do they need at the moment  (treatment and investigations always have to be balanced against welfare needs of the animal and costs - can this be done?)  4) What is the right thing to do next?  -    Essentially, this is all that you need to know.  When a family member is ill, it helps me to record the salient points on a speech recorder, or to ask them to write it very clearly in the notes and give me a copy.   I hope that your vet gives you just the informaiton that you need to know, and that you can find it in yourself to trust their answers and move on.  Sometimes we just have to do that, but I appreciate that it isn't easy.  Wishing you all the best.
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Pips
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April 08, 2024 at 09:22am
hi. i'm so sorry - i am jus seeing this now and thank you so much. I wish I were able to explain the cultural differences in our South American city in a way that could be relatable. But in addition to there are no medical records other than tests, my dog's past was not considered relevant until recently. when I was told her life today is a consequence of what those early tests revealed by the first person who agreed to even look at a couple of them (but none since). If it is remotely possible for you to share your experience about just one more specific even longer ago test, I would be so so grateful.  I think I can avoid the pitfalls of my prior question as it's just about possibilities for one result on a pee test within the context of two possibilities. In your experience, have an insanely high amount of leukocytes been related to either drug hypersensitivity or an immune disease? Your input would be so appreciated. I will add the test (in spanish), I think you you can understand the two abnormal results without Spanish. As my first dog, that was her first pee test, and I didn't ask questions or know why this test led, that day, to the vet inserted vaginal ovules of clindacin k for seven days (not asking why she did that, though I haven't been able to find anything online).  I know you're time is valuable and so many others have concerns about their pets. I am going to try to find a clear why to respond to your suggestions in hopes nothing I write could be received as a criticism of your field, as really the cultural differences are paramount.  In that response, I will explain why her past is, sadly, relevant to her problems today. But if your experience extends to this amount of leukocytes in a 3 month old puppy's urine that was related to immune/drug/inflammation (not infection). i would be so grateful to learn about that experience while trying to write a brief as possible explanation to the other comments. and thank you so so much Screen Shot 2024-04-08 at 5.14.29 AM
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Pips
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April 08, 2024 at 09:44am
Your second question is the one that sadly dictates the rest. I need to figure out, from her past, which drugs caused her adverse reactions so that a vet can know which drugs not to give her.  I have been working on this task since I was told that her life is a consequence of a few things that were apparently revealed in her first few tests- and I listed two of them- immune (disease, disorder, I’m not sure), and drug hypersensitivity.  Because there are no medical records, I have spent hundreds of hours since being told that, trying to reconstruct her drug past. There are many challenges from many drugs being given simultaneously to inconsistencies re: what I was told was injected to frequent drug changes that were done via whatsapp messages and phone calls. I am doing my best to try to create that list, of drugs- I am not qualified to speculate which were good or bad, but hope to produce something a vet may look at before injecting her with something.   So, until I can do that, no symptom can be treated as no treatment can be provided without it being one that won’t cause adverse reactions.   Beyond that, her 7th echo has inspired many responses. Our current vet thinks I am giving her benazepril. I am not. I cannot exclude enalapril from the ‘bad’ drug list. None of the vets who looked at that echo looked at any of the previous ones. Her echos + her life = not something that other dogs experience. I have no illusions anything happening beyond my hopeful ability to extract something from her past that informs a vet of something that helps them just be able to pick a drug to reduce pain.  Her symptoms make no sense. Her tests and symptoms are not helpful to past vets who hoped to provide diagnostic clarity. At this point, I just need to do something impossible with her undocumented past. I think I was hoping that learning anything about what may be unusually abnormal results could somehow guide me in my task in was I can’t imagine.   I apologize for writing things that are twilight zoney- because of our lives here, I am unable to produce sentences that resonate with the experiences of any other person, so far.   The right thing to do, to me, would be provided by a vet that doesn’t exist where we live- whatever they say to help them learn how to help my dog.   So right now there are no answers I am being given, just a task from one vet, that I am working on tirelessly, and then one vet who has not provided any answer, but a prescription to a med that doesn’t seem to be indicated by an echo that has inspired many different responses. I feel the right thing to do is not to give her a med until I can find a vet who can look at something I am doing my best to produce so that they can tell me what med, if any, is possible and indicated.   Im sorry. I can’t ask or imagine anyone could read anything I write and imagine its an actual reality. But it’s ours.  I hope this made sense kinda-
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